ID help please

[Banded Yeoman]

Just one lascar for now... judging by the rather thick grey lines, I'm guessing this should be P. hordonia. Is it a male or a female?

Correction: Pantoporia sandaka male
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/939/42955544194_6c7f1ca40b_b.jpg

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/942/43625251162_89e39db4e8_b.jpg

Thanks!

[Psyche]

Male P. sandaka.

This is one of those which can be rather confusing.
The grey band is much constricted, beaded & mostly disappear above & below.
The foot of the postdiscal band which runs along the lower margin (dorsum) is large & long.
There is a hint of the white speculum on the HW by the white line below the FW.

In P. hordonia the the grey band is broad & continuous &, the foot of the postdiscal band in the male smaller & shorter.
Typical wsf ,P. hordonia hordonia.
China.
https://farm6.static.flickr.com/5813/22046548666_a6b8cd235a_b.jpg
Thailand.
https://wingscales.com/content/record/450-1-c2fd9.jpg
Raub Malaya.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-6TIVtGI_okk/U3dZiNWZG2I/AAAAAAAAOdc/ONasPwcgx60/s1600/DSC_0229.JPG
Taman Negara Malaya.
http://www.learnaboutbutterflies.com/Pantoporia%20hordonia%20001a.jpg

Forms with broad orange bands, dsf or partial dsf Thailand. Note grey band is a bit more restricted.
http://www.norththailandbirding.com/images/large/butterflies_c/th/common_lascar_05.JPG
https://www.thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Pantoporia-hordona-1080x675.jpg

P. sandaka sandaka ,Raub, Malaya.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-c8rXTibfeqY/Une7uK6IDRI/AAAAAAAALeU/9RQQGiO1Jvk/s400/DSC_0137.JPG

TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks Dr Seow!

[Banded Yeoman]

Here's a Nacaduba from today... it is quite faded. Is it possible to ID this one?

ID as Nacaduba subperusia lysa
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/933/29841807428_0fe559be5e_b.jpg

[atronox]

WOW Jon it looks like N. subperusia lysa, which would be a rediscovery. Notice the post-discal series on the hindwing is very straight and practically touching the submarginal series; the gap between is smaller than all the others in the pavana group. The submarginal striae, in stark contrast, are much more rounded than the striae immediately basad to them.

Where was this taken?

[Banded Yeoman]

This was taken in usr! The upperside was a dull purple if I remember correctly..

[Psyche]

WOW Jon it looks like N. subperusia lysa, which would be a rediscovery. Notice the post-discal series on the hindwing is very straight and practically touching the submarginal series; the gap between is smaller than all the others in the pavana group. The submarginal striae, in stark contrast, are much more rounded than the striae immediately basad to them.

Where was this taken?


Concur it is N. subperusia lysa.

N. sanaya can sometimes cause confusion but the FW postdiscal band is always distinctly dislocated at vein 6.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-XEY63bA0JPA/UrRJN5MTKUI/AAAAAAAAM-8/MvgQVQTQHKk/s1600/HFH_0286+Nacaduba+sanaya+elioti.jpg

The other similar one which normally is commoner is N. hermus swatipa.

N. hermus swatipa.
FW postdiscal band not or barely dislocated at vein 6.
Dark striae often weakly present.
HW tornal black spot almost always with some metallic blue scales.
http://nlliew66butterflies.blogspot.com/2017/02/nacaduba-hermus-swatipa-corbet.html


TL Seow: Cheers.

[atronox]

This was taken in usr! The upperside was a dull purple if I remember correctly..

USR seems to be home to a lot of surprises!

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks Aaron and Dr Seow for the ID input! It is very likely to me that all our original Nacaduba species are still extant, just that they may have been either ignored or mis-identified in the past. It doesn't help that most of our encounters with them are fleeting, flying-by sightings. I often see them fluttering high above the ground in the treetops.

[Banded Yeoman]

Here are a few more Lycaenids...

In my view, the 6-line Nacaduba species can be more confusing to separate than the 4-line ones. I've attempted to identify them based on what I've read from previous posts. Dr Seow, Aaron, what do you think?


1) Nacaduba berenice male
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/929/43803927291_500a4117d9_b.jpg

2) N. beroe male
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1799/41995843600_0049807947_b.jpg

3) N. beroe male
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/857/28867734397_6fda02a21a_b.jpg

4) Nacaduba beroe female
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/851/42901334405_38b81ddf1e_b.jpg

Arhopala. epimuta male
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/928/42890548475_32a3a9ff6c_b.jpg

[Psyche]

Post 10.

1.Male Nacaduba berenice.

2, & 3. males N. beroe

4. Female N. beroe.

5. Arhopala epimuta.

The 6line Blues need to be identified by the sex first.

Male ;FW apex blunt,termen fairly straight; abdominal end truncated & brush like.; palpi short (not reliable)

Female ;FW apex pointed follow by a convex termen. abdominal pointed without a brush. Palpi longer but confusing in photos.


Male 6Line Blues.
A. Dark striae strong .
A1, N berenice; FW postdiscal typically broken in the middle ;submarginals irregular.
A2, N. calauria ;FW postdiscal almost always straight & unbroken; FW submarginal spots 4 & 5 sharp pointed.

B. Dark striae weak/moderate to obsolete.FW termen always rather straight.
B1. N. beroe : FW innermost (costal spot 12)absent; postdiscal band broken in the middle ;lower 3 submarginal rectangular; wingbase darkish.
B2; N kurava ;FW costal spot 12 always present; postdiscal usually fairly straight , not broken; submarginal often broad with rounded margins; wingbase not dark.


Female 6Line Blues.
All females have strong dark striae.

Female .N. beroe 'FW costal spot 12 absent or vestigial. FW postdiscal broken (variable) in the middle.

Female N. kurava;FW costal spot 12 present; FW postdiscal usually straight; submarginals large with rounded margins.

Female calauria. FW costal spot 12 present; postdiscal straight & unbroken; submarginal spots 4 & 6 sharp-pointed.

Female N berenice; FW costal spot 12 present; postdiscal usually partially broken in the middle; submarginals irregular; spot 4 & 6 not sharper than the others.

eg N. calauria male on the left, female on the right.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Nacaduba%20berenice%20icena/june%2014%20mating%20nacaduba%20berenic%20-%20Ellen%20Tan.JPG


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks for the detailed response Dr Seow!

I understand Nacaduba can be difficult to identify with certainty with underside shots only. However, would there be any 6-line species that were recorded in Singapore but missed in recent searches?

Also, is it correct to say that the 4-line species do not need to be identified by sex first.. Or did this rule apply across the whole genus?

[Psyche]

Thanks for the detailed response Dr Seow!

I understand Nacaduba can be difficult to identify with certainty with underside shots only. However, would there be any 6-line species that were recorded in Singapore but missed in recent searches?

Also, is it correct to say that the 4-line species do not need to be identified by sex first.. Or did this rule apply across the whole genus?

All 6line blues are accounted for.
A rare highland endemic is present in P. Malaysia, N. kirtoni.

Generally it is good to know the sex.
The females all have broader markings ,but otherwise ID features are the same as for the males.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Dr Seow, good to hear that for the 4-line species, the ID features are largely the same between sexes.. That certainly makes life a little easier!

Here's a break from the usual Lycaenids.. shot on Ubin. I'm assuming that it is Amathusia phidippus, since it is the only species that seems to be recorded around here. Yet, the pale markings and deeper indented bands caught my attention.

ID as Amathusia friderici holmanhunti
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1771/28942927407_0a645ef7ae_b.jpg

[Psyche]

Post 14.

It looks like you have found another new species.
This is Amathusia friderici holmanhunti .

If you look at the HW 4th dark band from the base, it is narrow & notched in the sides.
This typical of several other species.
In A. phidippus, this band is entire usually & not notched on the sides.

Examples of A. phiddippus from Singapore.
https://wanderingbutterflyeffect.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/6a0100a801ee89000e0123dde7731b860b.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_yzw2AzY2du4/SjD6sK1Vx7I/AAAAAAAACzk/TU5AjJvVyds/s400/Palm-King-KSK.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Amathusia%20phidippus%20phidippus/Palm%20King%20-%20Nelson%20Ong.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Amathusia%20phidippus%20phidippus/Palm%20King%20-%202%20-%20Federick%20Ho.jpg

A. friderici ; HW 4th dark band narrow & notched on the sides.
Malaya
http://lithops.com.ua/image/cache/data/insecta/babochki/amatusia/Amathusia%20phidippus%20fem-500x500.JPG
Southern Thailand.
http://paro6.dnp.go.th/paro6_royal_project/Web%20Butterflies%20%20hara%20Bala/Butterflies%20pages/Picture/Amathusii/Malay%20palmking.jpg

A. perakensis : HW 4th dark band broken & head end separated.
https://www.thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Amathusia-perakana-1080x719.jpg

A. binghami ;HW 4th dark band lightly notched ;main band reddish & broad.
https://a4.pbase.com/g9/25/686825/2/155684525.KgQ4Jik0.jpg


A. friderici 's host plant is the common oilpalm & it is reported to be common in some oilpalm plantations.
The form utana which is commoner is very dark ,almost black in the male upperside.
You may have notice this as it flies off. This looks like a female though.
TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks Dr Seow! I was aware that there were many more "Palm Kings" in the region but had no clue how to identify them, or even expect to see anything besides the usual A. phidippus.

There were several individuals flying around in the thicket. I do recall them to be very black when in flight, which attracted my attention in the very first place. I cannot say whether the upperside was black for this specific individual however, as I wasn't keeping track of them.

[Banded Yeoman]

Two more Amathusia for consideration, both shot in Ubin. The first is my sighting, while the second is a shot sent to me by Mr Michael Soh (on the forums as Blue Pansy). Aaron, Dr Seow, what do you think?

1) ID as Amathusia friderici holmanhunti
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1775/43851196042_47f31fa746_b.jpg

2) Amathusia phidippus, by Michael Soh
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/857/28962825137_27021f287b_b.jpg

[Psyche]

Post 17.

The 1st is undoubtedly A. friderici.

The 2nd one is a bit tricky.
I think it is a variant of A. phidippusbut I am not too sure at the moment.

TL Seow: Cheers.

PS. On reflection 2 is more likely to be A. friderici as well.

[Psyche]

Having look through many pix of Amathusia from Singapore, the 2nd pix in which the 4th HW band is not distinctly notched by the veins is best left as A. phidippus.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Aaron, Dr Seow, here are some skipper shots that I cannot ID.... Your opinions are greatly appreciated! :cheers:

1) Potanthus ganda female..
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1849/44083983542_c3e94cbda0_b.jpg

2) Baoris farri male
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1872/30264842358_13b9363757_b.jpg

3) Caltoris cormasa female
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1878/44083987462_079a850cda_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1891/44083988142_9d530bb817_b.jpg

4) Borbo cinnara female
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1855/30264838498_b76b035230_b.jpg

5) Pelopidas mathias male
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1837/44083986282_389f05ac23_b.jpg

[Psyche]

Post 20.

1 Potanthus ganda female.
Veins may be slightly dark dusted at times; more orange than omaha & dark shading stronger.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Ht4NZzQNDAw/Wcuga8PmFPI/AAAAAAAAr-w/cySTrPvk6d0M71ZMAUNioKiQC9ZGpCr-wCLcBGAs/s1600/Potanthus_ganda_cat3of4_underside.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-X9BG2_Zk_Ps/Wc8m3pfjCiI/AAAAAAAAr_U/uyzaS7MpTEUu75uRd84GtIz705wU2thrgCLcBGAs/s1600/GandaDart_Adult_02.jpg
Female P. omaha.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-MF0Ou8Bsf6g/UzvTW52eX4I/AAAAAAAANqE/7kUqNhh7KgM/s1600/DSC_0189.JPG

2. Baoris farri male.
The underside view shows a lot of the pale areas on the antennal ;Upper FW cellspot is round; HW with a cellend mark (where the hair tuft sprout on the upperside.)
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/BaorisFarri/BaorisFarri_SubramanyamKalluri_ak295.jpg

3 Caltoris cormasa female . Reddish tone is typical.

4. Borbo cinnara female;
The arrangement of the 3 main HW spots 2, 3, & 6 is typical. A small spot 4 is seen. Face & chest white.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-jMZu5Yy4Yg0/U5srGBECJPI/AAAAAAAAduM/h_NUjDNPj3M/s1600/FS_adult_Federick_01.jpg

5. Pelopidas mathias male.
When the HW spots are tiny the cellspot may sometimes be absent. The UnH is irregularly pale shaded.

P. agna male 1. with absent HW cellspot & 2 with HW cellspot barely present.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-y9RT--lWNeE/Uraxk5ArlYI/AAAAAAAANGE/G65DtuI1PU4/s1600/HFH_0032+Borbo+cinnara.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/---kNw2cMzXk/Vk6sG-yQ4pI/AAAAAAAAkis/_D9yI2uoj9Y/s1600/PA_male_05a.jpg

Borbo have thicker antennal clubs. Also face & chest strongly white.

Parnara bada have short stubby antennae.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-r10tmE1ODKA/UPa4h8TT-8I/AAAAAAAAIw0/fRcHm9s-F9M/s1600/LKW+2009+parnara+bada.jpg

TL Seow :Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Dr Seow, thanks for the speedy response! I've been looking through older Caltoris shots too... In hopes of finding something unusual but they are all just cormasa.

[Banded Yeoman]

One shot from the weekend.. Is this correctly Lasippa tiga? (ALso, is it possible to determine sex?) Thanks! :cheers:

Lasippa tiga male
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1890/42470932470_f199172a4c_b.jpg

[Psyche]

Yes 6this is a male Lasippa tiga.
There should not be too much reliance on the tongue shaped spot at the cellend. It varies too much to be reliable.

Submarginal spot 3 is 2x the width of the adjacent spot 4 above it. (note spot 2 is always narrow)
This view in the set position (as in a museum specimen)
If you view it sideway ,submarginal spot 3 is 2x the height of spot 4.


The male is readily ID'ed by the longer foot along the dorsum (lower margin) of the spot in space 1b. The head (spot 2) is almost always attached to the foot in the male ;Also termen is slightly indented.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Lasippa%20tiga%20siaka/ML_Horace_01.jpg

The female have a very short 'foot'; The head is usually detached & the termen is straighter, apex more rounded.
https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7297/15870256003_bcaa7307b5_b.jpg
https://wanderingbutterflyeffect.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/6a0100a801ee89000e0110162e0d89860b.jpg


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks for the pointers Dr Seow! Interesting that the sexes are actually so different on the upperside. I always assumed they were identical! :cheers:

[Banded Yeoman]

Some Potanthus species that were spotted during the drizzle yesterday morning... I've attempted to identify them. Hopefully the IDs (and sex) are correct!

(Also, off topic, I've decided to post my images larger to help with spotting minute differences between species. The 1024 x 683 size also looks better on the mobile forums.)

1) Potanthus trachala tytleri? Unsure which sex
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1892/42653385190_857723aecd_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1898/42653386130_9d2e6e499a_b.jpg

2) Potanthus omaha omaha male?
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1898/42653384170_471d9cb2cb_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1889/42653383060_54e73a305d_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1860/42653381950_3ce60da855_b.jpg

[Banded Yeoman]

cont' from the last post: some Satyrinae!

3) Mycalesis mineus
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1887/43746017344_1a482a6567_b.jpg

4) Mycalesis perseus
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1850/44463994111_2cb892bcf8_b.jpg

5) 3) Mycalesis perseus
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1895/42654880470_1bd173b601_b.jpg

6) 3) Mycalesis mineus
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1883/43746016024_ba68e27556_b.jpg

7) Ypthima horsfieldi
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1873/43746007784_d679a6aaf6_b.jpg

[Psyche]

Post 26.

1a. This is probably female Potanthus ganda.
FW shape termen rounded; FW cell with wider black 'hole.
UnF spot 4 overlapping spot 3. Veins across FW spots not black dusted.

1b Male Potanthus trachala. FW spot 4 & 5 without overlap above & below them; spots with concave margins; abdominal end black-banded.
P. trachala male.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_yzw2AzY2du4/TR30Ycoju7I/AAAAAAAAFa0/EEVwAxxbb_c/s1600/Potanthus_male_upperside_01.jpg
Two females.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-zzPOcxjK2F4/Vj29AmaqrYI/AAAAAAAAXL4/XuPHIe7N9HE/s1600/DSC_0246.JPG
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-prXDPS1KR7c/VGIH073q0jI/AAAAAAAARII/Cnms89zKEes/s1600/DSC_0073.JPG
Female UnH showing spot 4 have no overlap with spot 3.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Potanthus%20trachala%20tytleri/Potanthus_male_01.jpg

2. This is quite difficult but since most of the veins appeared to be lightly black-dusted I leave it as P. omaha.
The gemeral orangey appearance suggest P. ganda.
P. omaha ;dull ochreous yellow ; veins darkened including on the FW.
Males ; pair- female on the right.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Potanthus%20omaha%20omaha/272%20Potanthus%20omaha%20omaha%20(Lesser%20Dart)% 20Bobby%20Mun.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Potanthus%20omaha%20omaha/Lesser%20Dart%20-%20Fedrick%20Ho.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-IJRazQaHR5M/VI_X1fUu6rI/AAAAAAAASeA/YLTvojsHcws/s1600/DSC_0005.JPG
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-SeSVvRKmjXg/T4BLxF0t2VI/AAAAAAAAFqw/fHQyEBiRYfE/s1600/DSC4994+Mating+Potanthus+omaha.jpg

P. ganda: More orangey; veins not or slightly dark-dusted; usually darker heavier shadings.
2 males & 1 female.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-7ap54Ani6S0/UhhSDPG8H_I/AAAAAAAALxM/uITq3MqCC6A/s1600/HFH7170-Potanthus-sp.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-r1T4ajMPuVQ/Wmfi2GgfpLI/AAAAAAAAOkY/jv666Pzc-P4hAR9LfytxbX4u--_eoqFnwCLcBGAs/s1600/Potanthus%2Bganda%2B%2528Ganda%2BDart%2529%2B%2528 6%2529.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Ht4NZzQNDAw/Wcuga8PmFPI/AAAAAAAAr-w/cySTrPvk6d0M71ZMAUNioKiQC9ZGpCr-wCLcBGAs/s1600/Potanthus_ganda_cat3of4_underside.jpg

Post 27.

3 & 6 Mycalesis mineus ; Indentation formed by HW ocelli triahgle skewed upwards.

4 & 5. Mycalesis perseus :indentation formed by HW ocelli wider & deeper ;HW lower 4 spots out of line.; FW spots often in an arc.

7. Ypthima horsfieldii ;whiter ground ; separated spots; spot 2 & 3 more level with the space 1b spots.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks for the IDs Dr Seow! :cheers:

As for the Potanthus species, lighting conditions and post processing differences can really affect the colour of these yellowish-orange butterflies. One quick adjustment could make the skipper more yellow or more orange. To further the confusion, different screens and monitors display colours differently. The use of the "redness" as a characteristic for identifying P. ganda has to be supplementary only... Checking whether the upperside veins are dark dusted or not seems to me a more concrete ID key.

I noticed that photographs of P. omaha showing strong dark dusting on the underside veins are often of more worn individuals. Perhaps the wear and tear also adds to the darkened veins. The Potanthus no. 2 (post 26) was very fresh and his could explain the lighter veins.

Just out of curiosity, when dealing with Potanthus, would you say that the upperside features are more conclusive in determining the species?

[Psyche]

Thanks for the IDs Dr Seow! :cheers:

As for the Potanthus species, lighting conditions and post processing differences can really affect the colour of these yellowish-orange butterflies. One quick adjustment could make the skipper more yellow or more orange. To further the confusion, different screens and monitors display colours differently. The use of the "redness" as a characteristic for identifying P. ganda has to be supplementary only... Checking whether the upperside veins are dark dusted or not seems to me a more concrete ID key.

I noticed that photographs of P. omaha showing strong dark dusting on the underside veins are often of more worn individuals. Perhaps the wear and tear also adds to the darkened veins. The Potanthus no. 2 (post 26) was very fresh and his could explain the lighter veins.

Just out of curiosity, when dealing with Potanthus, would you say that the upperside features are more conclusive in determining the species?

Yes the colour is often very confusing in photos, but when it comes to skippers every little details help.
In thr case of P. ganda it is less likely for it to be as pale & dull as in P. omaha, while many omahas appeared too orange.

Here is a fresh P. omaha showing the darkened veins.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Potanthus%20omaha%20omaha/PM_adult_release_site_01.jpg

The upperiside can also be confusing.
Typical P. omaha with darkened HW veins.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Potanthus%20omaha%20omaha/Lesser%20Dart%20-%202%20-%20Tan%20CP.jpg
https://www.nss.org.sg/gallery_images/f7833edd-b449-4b80-82d2-189155b759d1Potanthus%20omaha%20omaha%20(Lesser%20 Dart)-PRP_20130120_O107_resize.jpg

Typical P. ganda.
Bred by Horace.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-dEQvLGTcjCc/WckUTBk8QEI/AAAAAAAAr5Q/MVSCKrhLkEA0bSNn8QwZFrjyKvYN7-c-ACLcBGAs/s1600/PM_adult_BTVC_01.jpg

Probable P. ganda
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/kingcrow28/media/cGF0aDovMDYwNDIwMTJ1cGxvYWQ4LmpwZw==/?ref=
There are actually many examples where the veins are just a little black dusted & you are not sure if it is due to abrasion.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

I was just telling Aaron about how none of my shots of Mycalesis have turned out to be Mycalesis visala... Though I'm certain I've photographed it before.

*Aaron, you also told me that I'd know it when I see it. I believe this recent shot may be it.

ID as Mycalesis visala phamis
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1867/29882556217_867926538f_b.jpg

[Psyche]

In Singapore this has largely been left as M. visala ,but it has an intermediate look, suggesting a hybrid element.
It will nice to check the upperside to ascertain its proper ID.

True M. visala have the HW inner margins of the ocelli form a more regular indentation; the dark line less spiky.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-i4MxrattNb4/U9O6GlHllZI/AAAAAAAAeZk/uVb3iMQ8b3M/s1600/LBBB_adult_Loke_01.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Mycalesis%20visala%20phamis/Long%20Brand%20Bush%20Brown%20-%20Nelson%20Ong.jpg

M. perseoides have the indentaion formed by the inner margins of the ocelli large & rather irregular; the dark line very spiky; the 'tooth' at the lower end may sometimes be 'flattened'.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Mycalesis%20perseoides%20perseoides/Mycalesis-perseoides%20-%20Khew.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Mycalesis%20perseoides%20perseoides/MPP_adult_Federick_01.jpg

On the upperside FW the ocellus is large & clear.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks Dr Seow! I'll be sure to get an upperside shot next time.. For now, I'll leave this is as a typical M. visala.

[atronox]

Interesting. Previously i would've thought such individuals with the whitened area between the ocelli and submarginal bands were visala

[Banded Yeoman]

A few Lemon Emigrants that I've shot... what forms are they (and are they all females)?

1. f-jugurtha
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1895/43005123750_ffc23b0fc8_b.jpg

2. f-crocale
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1844/43005128900_ea51894829_b.jpg

3. f-crocale
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1892/43005133010_4c558567a0_b.jpg

[Psyche]

POst 35.

Al females can be recognised by the HW black border & more rounded wingshape.

A. crocale type ;antennae black above, Underside without silvery spots ringed in red. Cause : larva exposed to > 13 hours day-lenght.

Male f- alcmeone.
female f-jugurtha Uppersde white , base yellow, with narrow HW border & a few black submarginal spots.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/CatopsiliaPomona/thumb/th_31CatopsiliaPomona_KSaji_ac364.jpg
female f- crocale ; white, base yellow, with broad black border enclosing white spots.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/CatopsiliaPomona/thumb/th_02CatopsiliaPomona_RohitGirotra_ai191.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2018/908_29081-900-5af130c490b10-1.jpg

B. pomona type. antennae red above; Underside with silvery spots ringed in red/blackish red. Cause :Larva exposed to < 11 hours day-lenght.

Male f- hilaria.
female f- pomona Upperside yellow.
female f- nivescens ;Upperside white.
female f- catilla; underside with patchy red marks

These three are females of 1. f-jugurtha. and 2 & 3. f- crocale.
Note image 2 & 3 have an UnH vague spot in the middle. These may be considered as intermediates.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks for the detailed response on the various forms! I've yet to shoot all of them.

[Banded Yeoman]

Here are some recent Arhopala shots that I've taken. Dr Seow, Aaron, I hope your expertise can help in identifying them.:cheers:

1) Arhopala pseudomuta (medium size)
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1950/44098340015_26aa0e77f5_b.jpg

The rest were all observed in the same area. They were so small I didn't even realise they were Arhopala at first! (Just to add, they were all seen in a small forest clearing within a 5 metre radius.)

2) No idea... size is tiny. ID as Arhopala muta / moorei
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1914/44290296594_48c9df7c0e_b.jpg

3) Another tiny one... ID as female Arhopala muta
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1958/44098339515_7ae759ac66_b.jpg

4) Tiny. Managed to get a few views of this pristine individual - hope the partial upperside and extended forewing are of some use!
ID as male Arhopala muta
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1963/44290295924_e7d99f1a37_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1939/44098338965_3d0c3709c9_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1968/44290296204_94b8b5344f_b.jpg

[atronox]

#1 Yes, it's pseudomuta. They seem to be in season these past few months. Sometimes they have a pinkish glaze which is a bit confusing but usually the shape of the spots is sufficient to distinguish it from the other rarer species

#2 Should be A. antimuta. The markings tend to be more indistinct

#3 and #4 Quite certain these are A. moorei busa. The spots are narrower than in muta. I posted a dorsal shot of a female recently which i think is quite likely moorei as well

[Banded Yeoman]

Yes there were a number of A. pseudomuta-type Arhopala flying that day.

Regarding no. 2, I was hesitant to place it as A. antimuta due to HW spot 7 being shifted in from spot 6. I believe it is a reliable feature of A. antimuta that spot 7 is aligned directly above spot 6.

[Psyche]

I can't see no. 2 as antimuta because in antimuta spot 7 is always on top of spot 6 though in various ways.
There are many good examples from Singapore before.
Following the key it ends up as a muta/moorei.

3& 4 are interesting because spot 4 & 5 are partially out of line (in line in no. 2) and the dislocation at vein 2 is wide ,with a gap especially in no. 4.
The wide dislocation suggest A. kurzi but the UpF wider border is that of A. muta.
The upperside with the FW darker & the HW lighter is as for most A. muta.

The spot shape & arrangement are probably variants from different colonies.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks Aaron and Dr Seow. :cheers:

Dr Seow, after looking through C&P4 today I can appreciate how similar A. muta and A. moorei are. However, I noticed a feature of A. moorei is that the FW upperside border is wider than the HW, a feature I believe is shown in Arhopala no. 4 (I hope I am not over-simplifying matters!) However, I still cannot appreciate which features are important in deciding the species or not.

Could you educate me on the ways of separating these species? (and would you be confident in assigning IDs to the Arhopalas 2, 3 and 4?)
Thanks very much!

[Psyche]

The ID of these Arhopala are very difficult without seeing the upperside.
Although no2 , 3, & 4 looks different they could all be one species, merely from different colonies.

Arhopala metamuta; FW deepviolet blue; HW bright greenish blue : female bright blue with HW border wider than female A. muta.
UnF spot 2 & 3 with their margins aligned.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:ArhopalaMetamuta_691_4_Fitch.png

A. muta: Male FW violet blue; HW paler blue or only partially /basally .Female bright purple blue with wider border, (HW border narrower than in F. metamuta).
UnFc spot 2 & 3 partially dislocated & out of alignment.

A. moorei Male both wings violet blue ; female duller purple blue than female muta.
Underside FW spot 2 & 3 partially dislocated as in A. muta.

Unfortunately there is a lot of confusion with these species.

Here is a good one.
1. female A. muta .2. Female A. moorei 3. Male A. muta & 4 female A. muta.
http://v3.boldsystems.org/index.php/Taxbrowser_Taxonpage?taxid=106870

There are a lot of mixedup on the net.
There is also confusion with A. hypomuta, the female with very broad borders.
In A. hypomuta the FW spot 4 is dislocated & shifted out (as in A atosia).HW sometimes with a spot at the base of space 6.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arhopala_hypomuta#/media/File:ArhopalaHypomutaDevaMFUpUnAC1.jpg

Back to the three.
Usual A. muta/moorei underside.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Arhopala%20muta%20maranda/MutalOakblue-HoraceT2.jpg

No. 2 is unusually pale & diffrent, with smaller spots. Possibly A. metamuta.

3 & 4 . They are probably from the same colony. The wide dislocation of the postdiscal band at vein 2 is unusual.
The upperside with difference in FW & HW indicate it is A. muta .


TL Seow: Cheers.

[atronox]

Many thanks for the correction and pointers. I completely forgot about that feature in antimuta.



The wide dislocation suggest A. kurzi but the UpF wider border is that of A. muta.


I had thought of kurzi but ruled that out because Jonathan said it was very small. If i recall correctly kurzi is the size of amphimuta. It is supposed to occur in Singapore though

[Psyche]

I had thought of kurzi but ruled that out because Jonathan said it was very small. If i recall correctly kurzi is the size of amphimuta. It is supposed to occur in Singapore though

A kurzi's measurement FW 18-22mm. the lower figure is within the range of muta/moorei.
Tantalizing but FW spot 3 is usually wide (ie elongate horizontally) in A. kurzi.

Quite a number of these small species in Singapore have probably been overlooked.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Aaron, Dr Seow, A. kurzi was exactly what I was hoping it was. That was until I saw the upperside, which immediately dispelled that. :prrr:

Regarding all these small Arhopala species, I would believe most of them exist in small, localised colonies, such as the one I encountered, rather than merely being overlooked. Even for a rather casual observer like myself, the unusual size of these Arhopalas from the muta subgroup and such is enough to create a lot of interest in the field. They seem to have very beautiful uppersides too. I am curious about how A. metamuta would appear in flight! They are more likely to be investigated than perhaps, a medium sized Arhopala, which may likely be the usual species (A. epimuta, A major etc.)

Either that, or I've just not been observant enough to spot them all these years! :bsmile:

Also, thanks for all the explanations about these species. I really learnt a lot. I will work harder to get corresponding upperside shots for my Arhopala in the future! :cheers:

[Banded Yeoman]

A few more Arhopala...


1) Medium size, heavily cropped - ID as Arhopala athada
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1943/44174991675_2201a4932c_b.jpg

2) Medium size, heavily cropped. Confirmed as A. amphimuta
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1956/44961364332_d783035052_b.jpg

3) Medium size. A. major
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1922/43198055930_a10c59f007_b.jpg

4) Medium size, heavily cropped. Confirmed as A. epimuta
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1955/30073251527_dcbb3dfdc5_b.jpg



I'm assuming there is only one Chersonesia species in Singapore, Chersonesia peraka peraka. Is it possible to determine sex for this species? :cheers:
ID as a female due to rounded fw termen.
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1959/44174991125_1a3b4a04bb_b.jpg

[Banded Yeoman]

Dr Seow, Aaron, a few more skippers for consideration:

1) Polytremis lubricans
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1927/43278244340_e4ac8b352a_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1927/43278241830_e50e6743f1_b.jpg


2) Telicota besta (male)
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1918/44371579374_50dc2e24e7_b.jpg


3) Telicota besta (male)
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1908/30154188897_2a1845ea2a_b.jpg


4) Parnara bada (male)
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1938/30154187287_4d7558937b_b.jpg

5) Parnara bada (female)
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1963/30154185967_26910e3896_b.jpg


Thanks!!! :cheers:

[Psyche]

Post 47.

This is a strange one The UnH is that of A athada but the upperside is dark with the border a thread.
Possibly A. aroa.

.Arhopala athada. Variable in size, medium to large.
HW submarginal & posdiscal bands well separated. V spot well form; spot 6 typically astride spot 5 & cellend bar.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Arhopala%20athada%20athada/Vinous%20Oakblue%20-%20horace.jpg
https://ms.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arhopala_athada#/media/File:ArhopalaAthadaAthadaMUpUn.jpg

Arhopala aroa ; submarginal & postdiscal band well-separated (as in athada)
HW spot 6 usually narrower below. Upperside deeper & darker violet than all other alea subgroup member.
FW termen rounded.
No proper image on web
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:ArhopalaAroa_679_2_Knight.png


2. Possibility A. zylda , stubbsi & avathina. Correction avathina is out as its HW postdiscal band is completely dislocated.
The HW have no tooth at vein 2. HW postdiscal band is only partially dislocated at vein 2 ie the 'V' spot 1b overlaps spot 2.
This effecitvely eliminate A. kurzi, & metamuta/muta/moorei.

A. avathina has n FW basal cellspot (seem to have one just visible here.) Correction: avathina is out.

3. A. major.

4. A. epimuta ;note tornal white cilial dot; FW spot 4 dislocated outwards.

5, Chersonesia paraka female; Female have rounded FW.
Male & female.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Chersonesia%20peraka%20peraka/Little%20Maplet%201%20110908.jpg
https://img00.deviantart.net/e81b/i/2013/344/7/0/little_maplet_060713_2_by_inckurei-d6c8m3a.jpg

[Psyche]

Post 48.

1. Polytremis lubricans :FW cellspot often conjoined; Spot 2 is particularly large, ofte with a rounded inner margin.

Telicotas are often confusing with their colour in photos.

2. & 3. Male Telicota besta .Too orangey here. HW band crossed by dark-dusted veins.
Male with upperside confirmation.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-NbpYa8XexNw/VJQtyK97NHI/AAAAAAAASl0/i77WR2aduOU/s1600/DSC_0294.JPG

Similar
T. linna duller ochreous ;veins not dark-dusted underparts paler.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-7aMywOHZIiI/Vz1UG-Y6-3I/AAAAAAAAmSQ/O1Qd2JSxJl8D_uCe3e646iEfKN8iRFvpQCLcB/s1600/TL_male_03.jpg

T. augias ;veins not dark-dusted; strongly tawny orange.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Hp7OPF_eJ6Q/U6ZQMNh6IkI/AAAAAAAAOPs/KFaTN4_wis4/s1600/HFH_2956-Palm-Dart-(Telicota-augias-augias).jpg

4. male & % female Parnara bada. Note the female here has a HW cellspot but at the end (diffrent from Pelopidas.)
Note thich stubby antennal club.; HW no cellspot or at the cellend: HW spots irregular & small, variable number. often decreasing in size upwards.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Psyche]

Revision No. 2.

There seem to be a tooth at vein 2, a 'V' mark can just be made out at vein 2, just that it is out of focus.
The medium size would exclude both zylda & stubbsi.

With the presence of the tooth it is either A. amphimuta or major.
The postdiscal band is fairly intact & the V spot though fat have equal arms.

Most likely A. amphimuta
My slight reservation is that in this male the bit of HW upperside margin does not show any blue.
Typical A. amphimuta.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-J9Xmngyim6A/UZiTd2FbmPI/AAAAAAAAKLU/giYImR17uDw/s1600/HFH+4500+Arhopala+amphimuta+amphimuta.jpg

TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks for the IDs Uncle Seow. :cheers:


Regarding post 47 Arhopala no. 1, a possible explanation for the dark upperside colouration is that the angle of the butterfly to my camera's flash was such that the reflective scales did not shine back in my direction, leaving the wings looking dark. These reflective uppersides are bound to show different colours when light is shining at them from different angles. If you are confident this is A. athada from the upperside, I would leave it as such, since A. athada is a common species and it is more likely to be that. Unfortunately this is the only shot of this individual that I have. :-(

As for post 47 Arhopala no. 2, is it possible that it is a female A. amphimuta? The extent of the brown border does seem too broad.

[Banded Yeoman]

One Miletus for now...

Likely female Miletus gaesa
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1938/44238819145_3d07dee13f_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1914/30212631187_9323bf290f_b.jpg

[Psyche]

Thanks for the IDs Uncle Seow. :cheers:


Regarding post 47 Arhopala no. 1, a possible explanation for the dark upperside colouration is that the angle of the butterfly to my camera's flash was such that the reflective scales did not shine back in my direction, leaving the wings looking dark. These reflective uppersides are bound to show different colours when light is shining at them from different angles. If you are confident this is A. athada from the upperside, I would leave it as such, since A. athada is a common species and it is more likely to be that. Unfortunately this is the only shot of this individual that I have. :-(

As for post 47 Arhopala no. 2, is it possible that it is a female A. amphimuta? The extent of the brown border does seem too broad.


For no. 1 I leave it as A. athada.. I have look at it several times but can't explain the dull dark purple colour.
The profile shot means the butt is perpendicular to the camera.
All other Arhopala shot this way have a noticeable blue colour.

No 2 is probably female as the bulging abdomen indicate. The off-focus end look like a male.


Now the Milrtus you have shot is also interesting.

The 4 recorded species in Singapore are M. biggsii, symethus, gopara, & gaesa.

Note the three subapical spots are spot 4, 5, & 6, At t6he top of spot 6 is a small one in space 7 (not in space 9 as in Arhopala).
There are 3 costal spots spot 9, 10, & 11.

M. biggsii; FW spot 6 shifted out of line from spot 4 & 5.
Male.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Miletus%20biggsii%20biggsii/Miletus%20biggsii%20biggsii.jpg

eg females.
https://wanderingbutterflyeffect.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/6a0100a801ee89000e00fae8e9e02a000b.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Miletus%20biggsii%20biggsii/biggsagain%20-%20bene.jpg


M. gopara ;FW spot 6 almost in line. Female more prominent 'tailed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miletus_gopara#/media/File:MiletusGoparaGoparaMUpUnAC1.jpg
female.
http://v3.boldsystems.org/pics/BOPMB/GTE021%2B1341158498.JPG


M. gaesa ;FW spot 6 in line with spot 4 & 5; HW often with stronger tornal shading.

M. symethus.FW spot 6 almost in line; spots poorly defined ; whitish shading of apices of both wings.
female.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Miletus%20symethus%20petronius/Sunny-Chir---EOS-1D-Mark-III--30_08_2011--0562-copy-4.jpg


Are there examnples in the past.

Possible female M. gopara. The tail varies ;This one has it longer than the M. biggsii female.
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/digimania/media/cGF0aDovZ29wYXJhLmpwZw==/?ref=

Probable Female M. gaesa.
Spot 6 is virtually in line with spot 4 & 5.
The tornal shading may not be an ID feature. (image in Fleming has this).
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Miletus%20biggsii%20biggsii/biggs%20Brownie%20-%20Ellen%20Tan.JPG

Your pix also suggest male M. gaesa or M. gopara since FW spot 6 is in line with spot 4 & 5.
(if the tornal shading is an ID feature than it is closer to M. gopara.)

TL Seow: Cheers.

[Psyche]

Revision.

Your pic looks to be a female since there is a slight angulation of the HW.
Practically all malea have rounded HWs.

If a female then perhaps M. gaesa.


Mating pair M. biggsii.
https://nss.org.sg/butterflies_list/show_photo.php?img_id=589


The dislocation of FW spot 6 may be slight as same in the female on the left.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Miletus%20biggsii%20biggsii/biggsmating%20-%20bene.jpg

TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Uncle Seow, thanks for the ID and elaboration of the different Miletus species! :cheers:

I agree with you that this individual is a female, as the hindwings are distinctly angled. In the 2nd picture, the angle of the butterfly to the camera and the shallow depth of field makes this difficult to see.

Just to clarify, would M. gopara female have a more prominent tail as compared to M. gaesa female?

[Psyche]

Uncle Seow, thanks for the ID and elaboration of the different Miletus species! :cheers:

I agree with you that this individual is a female, as the hindwings are distinctly angled. In the 2nd picture, the angle of the butterfly to the camera and the shallow depth of field makes this difficult to see.

Just to clarify, would M. gopara female have a more prominent tail as compared to M. gaesa female?

Typically female M. gopara have longer tail at v4 than other species but this varies.
http://v3.boldsystems.org/pics/BOPMB/GTE021%2B1341158498.JPG

You can look at all three species, namely ,biggsii, gopara & gaesa at PL 8 & 9 here.
http://www004.upp.so-net.ne.jp/jamides/Borneobook/borneo-e.html


TL Seow: Cheers.
PS. The only way to be sure if this is something new is to see the upperside.

[Banded Yeoman]

Thanks for the clarification and the links Uncle Seow! :cheers:

[Banded Yeoman]

Dr Seow, Aaron, a few more arhopala for consideration, though I believe these are fairly typical. :cheers:


1) A. epimuta
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1928/45610819821_75b9a72652_b.jpg


2) A. pseudomuta male
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/45610817191_a0ec3cd7e3_b.jpg


3) A. pseudomuta female
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1926/45610814291_c43705814f_b.jpg


4) A. muta / moorei, likely muta. This one was definitely on the larger side for a muta-subgroup Arhopala, making me believe it is more likely to be a male A. muta.
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1960/44886323984_0298df38e2_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1977/45560220622_1b37813363_b.jpg


Finally, a Zographetus ogygia.
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1961/31738691358_69325d8470_b.jpg

[Psyche]

1. A. epimuta . Note white HW tornal spot.

2. A. pseudomuta male (shorter palpi, straighter FW margin.)
3 female.
The markings are more contrasted than usual ,suggesting some gene introgression ( cross bleeding).

Typical A. pseudomuta , Singapore .Markings not well contrasted; HW spot 6 quadrate, submarginal band continuous.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Arhopala%20pseudomuta%20pseudomuta/Pseudomuta%20-%203%20-%20Horace.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Arhopala%20pseudomuta%20pseudomuta/Pseudomuta---1---Horace.jpg


Typical A. alitaeus Singapore.Markings deeply contrasted; HW spot 6 round to oval ; submarginal band macular (composed of almost separated spots)
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-nEFhYQjWz64/VgOd5EMo77I/AAAAAAAAOO0/0oWqrOlqzEY/s1600/Arhopala%2Balitaeus%2B-%2BHoraceT.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Arhopala%20alitaeus%20pardenas/AA_adult_female_Simon_01.jpg


4. Hard to tell which. The lighter blue with hint of green suggest A. muta.
It is stated in Fleming the FW border is wider than that on the HW in A. moorei male.
https://singapore.biodiversity.online/species/A-Arth-Hexa-Lepidoptera-000441?imageId=0

5. Typical Zographetus ogygia.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[atronox]

Very nice Z. ogygia! Hope to find it someday

[Banded Yeoman]

Uncle Seow, thanks for the pointers! The two A. pseudomuta where observed within the same area. It seems to be the typical form found around there.

Aaron, thanks! It appears that they are found from time to time at USR. As for mine... Well, you know where it was shot. ;P

[Psyche]

Quite right all.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Dr Seow, Aaron, I believe I've shot the males of all our six-line Nacaduba species over the weekend. Are these IDs valid?

1) Nacaduba beroe
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7859/33174606528_d6ea547f8d_b.jpg

Upperside: no white scaling, does not appear powdery.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7896/47050013941_49b750e6ac_b.jpg

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7867/47050020791_a2d4a35e78_b.jpg


2) Nacaduba berenice
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7820/47050005221_b984399113_b.jpg

Upperside, as visible in the first shot as well, powdery blue with white scaling visible.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7820/32108287587_b8ea1bbe73_b.jpg



3) Nacaduba calauria
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7860/33174604988_d0718bd21b_b.jpg

Upperside: visibly darker than the other Nacaduba species flying around (presumably all N. berenice)
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7874/47050010301_45ed43303a_b.jpg

[Psyche]

They are as you indicated.

Notice the male N. berenice here is unusual in that the dark striae within the postdiscal band are largely missing. This is normally a feature of the N. beroe male.
Here is a more typical male N. berenice with the dark striae very strong.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Nacaduba%20berenice%20icena/Rounded%206%20Line%20Blue%20-%20Neo%20Chee%20Beng.jpg

You missed the N. kurava male.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Hmm. Comparing the N. beroe male and the N. berenice, it is still apparent that the dark striae are less developed in beroe.

Also, you're quite right I missed out N. kurava... I completely forgot about it! :bsmile: I'll try and get a shot next time.

[atronox]

The first one is Ionolyce helicon. The wing shape and the post-discal striae on the forewing in space CuA1 give it away. I've shot many of these hoping that one of them would turn out to be N. beroe. N. beroe seems rare- i've not seen one yet.

[Banded Yeoman]

Aaron, Dr Seow, I believe this is the next fourline-blue on our list: Nacaduba hermus. :cheers:

Upperside is violet-blue.
ID confirmed as Nacaduba hermus
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48581784042_aa3b048b54_b.jpg

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7808/32326682747_e87f7cbeea_b.jpg

[atronox]

Yes, it can only be hermus. What an exciting find! Pretty soon you'll probably get a clear shot of N. pendleburyi to complete the rarer four-lines

USR?

[Psyche]

Wonderful! You got it right.

There are several species recorded from Singapore in the past.


Nacaduba 4-lines with the dark striae absent or weak.

A. HW with the marginal & submarginal spots wider apart. 1. N. sanaya & 2 .pendleburyi.
B. HW with the marginal & submarginal spots near to each other 3. N. subperusia & 4. N. hermus.

N. hermus : HW black spot with metallic scales.
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/NacadubaHermus/NacadubaHermus_HemantOgale_ab589.jpg

N. subperusia ;HW black spot without metallic scales.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-CCzm1ZlQsQE/UrRNXf_V1vI/AAAAAAAAM_c/083nczhETzE/s1600/HFH_0013+Nacaduba+subperusia+lysa.jpg


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Aaron, Dr Seow,

I've been shooting lots of alea-subgroup Arhopala recently and several of them have had much wider fw post-discal bands. This one male which I tracked gave me a glimpse of the upperside, showing the fw border increasing in width towards the apex. The fw termen is also revealed to be evenly curved from the upperside.

To cut to the chase, I think this is Arhopala selta.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48239339672_1a00410784_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48239253156_c831f01aae_b.jpg

[atronox]

The border is definitely increasing in width but i'm not sure if this is wide enough for selta. Unfortunately this is a very poorly known group and there's very little information online and i don't have my references with me, so i'll let Dr Seow have a say :)

[Psyche]

Agreed it is Arhopala selta..

You have very clear shots of both surfaces ,so there is no ambiguity.

Thus it meet all the criteria.
1. UpF border increases towards the apex.
2. HW postdiscal spot 6 overlaps the cellend bar by half.
3. FW termen somewhat rounded.
Whether the FW postdiscal band is always relatively wide is hard to say.


Perhaps A. phaenops also occur in Singapore.

In the thread below, the male have a straight termen , the UpF border appears to be broad at the apex, & HW spot 6 barely overlaps the cellend bar.
Only the males of selta & phaenops have the UpF border increas at the apex.
All other males have the FW border a thread throughout.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/showthread.php?15442-Another-Arhopala-for-ID!


A male labelled as A. sublustris from Cambodia for comparison.
https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4564/38288393544_5244eda5c2_b.jpg


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Banded Yeoman]

Aaron, Dr Seow, thanks for confirming that for me.

I based my judgement on the key and plates from the marvellous Butterflies of Borneo, Vol.2 No.1 Lycaenidae （1991） by Yasuo Seki, Yusuke Takanami and Kazuhisa Otsuka. The male A. selta is a strong match to the one I shot.

Regarding the suspected A. phaenops that I shot a few years back, I'll leave as A. sublustris . Close examination of the hindwing border (which shows in one of the shots) reveals that it is a thread, only increasing in width below vein 2. This is typical of A. sublustris. In A. phaenops the border will be consistently thicker. There is a chance that the forewing border for my suspected A. phaenops is an illusion due to the odd chip off the wing, casting a shadow.

I have shot a number of typical A. sublustris and the borders are always a thread, with a bright blue upperside. I may post these later.

[Banded Yeoman]

Aaron, Dr Seow, I'm going through some Hesperiids from my collection and would very much appreciate your opinions on them.

Here we go: starting with some male Telicota. I have images of a few females but I understand that ID'ing them just by photos will be challenging and never absolute.
For each Telicota, I am 100% certain that I am presenting dorsal and ventral views of the same individuals.

1) Telicota colon stinga
- upF post-discal band continued distad by yellow streaks along the veins. In this individual, they are just shy of the termen
- un gound colour (from what I saw) ocherous yellow-orange
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48573622507_ebba4bcc47_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48573471016_807f2be223_b.jpg



2) Telicota linna
- Stigma in the centre of the black discal fascia
- upF base of space 2 black with no yellow
- upH yellow post-discal band barely continued beyond vein 6
- un ground colour (from what I saw) ocherous yellow
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48572351056_279481ef12_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48572502462_e6ee06fbf6_b.jpg


3) Likely to be Telicota besta bina - images of the stigma will be useful in future comparisons.
- upF base of space 2 orange
- upH post-discal band continued beyond vein 6
- ground colour (from what I saw) no greenish tinge, uniformly - and rather glowing - orange
The only thing holding me back is the placement of the stigma, which is closer to the inner edge of the black discal fascia. If one follows this feature, it can only be T. besta. Yet, the pure orange colour is quite clear in my memory.
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48572512527_bb8a1f7330_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48572361596_9da3f931bd_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48582675297_7da189058d_z.jpg

[Psyche]

Post 75.


1 is undoubtedly T. colon.
From the underside this can readily be ID'ed.
FW spot 4 is shifted farther out from spot 3 & likewise spot 5 is shifted out from spot 4.
There is little or no overlap between spot 5 & 6.

2 is also correct for T. linna.Base of space 2 is black & brand is straight.Face & underpart paler.

3. is Telicota besta. In field shot it often is too orange & confusing.

T. besta brand closer to inner margin of black space ;UnH veins across band very lightly dark-dusted.
Face is paler & often whitish.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-6-BjVfqOIQ0/U1vGug7ph3I/AAAAAAAAdO0/Emv5HEJEs0M/s1600/TB_adult_male_up_01.jpg
https://thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Telicota-besta-1-1080x720.jpg
This one below have upperside confirmation.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-NbpYa8XexNw/VJQtyK97NHI/AAAAAAAASl0/i77WR2aduOU/s1600/DSC_0294.JPG
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-n_yvZvniiOM/VJQtyNZmRuI/AAAAAAAASl4/IEKfYylJ0jU/s1600/DSC_0303.JPG

T. augias ;Uniform deep orange; Brand straight often occupying the full width of the black space.
UnH veins across band not dark-dusted; Face is orangey.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-y3LkExqbZs8/VgoXg4gxecI/AAAAAAAABhk/g-Exi9WYzh8/s1600/Telicota%2Baugias_male_2.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Hp7OPF_eJ6Q/U6ZQMNh6IkI/AAAAAAAAOPs/KFaTN4_wis4/s1600/HFH_2956-Palm-Dart-(Telicota-augias-augias).jpg


Overtime I have realise that the veins in T. augias should not be prominent.

Those deep orange images with the underside veins bulging & prominent are probably T. besta ,especially so if the face is whitish.
HOwever, I am still not absolutely certain.


TL Seow: CHeers.

[atronox]

Now i'm intrigued because i have something like the 3rd one which i thought was augias but now i'm not so sure. Will post soon

[Banded Yeoman]

Post 75.
3. is Telicota besta. In field shot it often is too orange & confusing.

T. besta brand closer to inner margin of black space ;UnH veins across band very lightly dark-dusted.
Face is paler & often whitish.

T. augias ;Uniform deep orange; Brand straight often occupying the full width of the black space.
UnH veins across band not dark-dusted; Face is orangey.

Overtime I have realise that the veins in T. augias should not be prominent.

Those deep orange images with the underside veins bulging & prominent are probably T. besta ,especially so if the face is whitish.
HOwever, I am still not absolutely certain.


Dr Seow, thanks for confirming with me the first 2 identities. They are fairly straightforward and cannot be mistaken if both sides are captured.

Regarding no. 3, the veins are actually not dark-dusted. It is just the shadows of the veins. I maintain that the colour really was a bright orange in the field and not just in the photograph.

I've included a cropped image of the other wing's stigma in post 75 to clear any doubts regarding its position and shape. Note that in C&P4, the feature of having the stigma filling the discal black striae is actually for T. hilda and not T. augias. I keep going back to the male that Soon Chye reared, since it has the confirmation of the genitalia. I have yet to find another close shot of a valid T/ augias for comparison. For T. besta, I take Horace's reared individuals as valid, since the features are all shown clearly. I believe Mr Foo has a nice T. augias upperside somewhere and I'm looking for it now.

I do agree, however, that my male leans towards T. besta and the colour is a problematic variation.

2597825979

[Psyche]

Dr Seow, thanks for confirming with me the first 2 identities. They are fairly straightforward and cannot be mistaken if both sides are captured.

Regarding no. 3, the veins are actually not dark-dusted. It is just the shadows of the veins. I maintain that the colour really was a bright orange in the field and not just in the photograph.

I've included a cropped image of the other wing's stigma in post 75 to clear any doubts regarding its position and shape. Note that in C&P4, the feature of having the stigma filling the discal black striae is actually for T. hilda and not T. augias. I keep going back to the male that Soon Chye reared, since it has the confirmation of the genitalia. I have yet to find another close shot of a valid T/ augias for comparison. For T. besta, I take Horace's reared individuals as valid, since the features are all shown clearly. I believe Mr Foo has a nice T. augias upperside somewhere and I'm looking for it now.



In C&P4 ' key T. augias is already separated from T. linna, hilda & ohara because the base of space 2 is black.

Key 7 (12) is only used to separate hilda & linna from T. ohara which has a very narrow brand.

Take a look at C&P4 plate 59, image 47 T. augias male & image 49 T. hilda male & look at their brand size.

Horace also show me set specimens of T augias male & female.
(I kept the images for comparison. The brand is straight & much closer to the outer margin of the black space.)

Here is another example of a typical male T. augias from Jerantut, Pahang P. Malaysia.
https://www.neutron.phys.ethz.ch/Lepidoptera/Old_Specimens/Hesperiidae/AZ11-1495R.jpg
https://www.neutron.phys.ethz.ch/Lepidoptera/Old_Specimens/Hesperiidae/AZ11-1495V.jpg

TL Seow: Cheers.

PS. Whether you can really see the veins dark -dusted or not is an unreliable feature in T. besta. ( If veins are not visibly dark, it cannot be dismissed.)
When it is really fresh it appear not dark dusted.
There are numerous examples.

T. colon is closely related ,the male with the same brand, & both have females which are greenish tinged UnH but hardly noticeable in field shots.
The male also present with the UnH veins with dark dustings or none.
https://thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Telicota-colon-1080x675.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JCIq17YMtX0/T4BMP2yGX4I/AAAAAAAAFrI/_53XDHovvNs/s1600/DSC_5034+Telicota+colon+stinga.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-iRfNeV5wQzA/UKzN8heYtNI/AAAAAAAAIoU/f3aJKVW5sQk/s1600/PalmDart-LemonTea.jpg

[Banded Yeoman]

With regards to dark dusting on the hindwing veins, I would only take it as a serious feature in the freshest of specimens. In too many worn individuals, the dark-dusting turns out to be just evidence of wear. That's another reason why I've only been photographing these fresh individuals.

Thanks for pulling those images of the Pahang T. augias. Telicota and Potanthus, while possible to identify from clear field shots, showing both sides of pristine individuals, definitely require more rigour in examining them. The fact is that for a long time, many butterfly enthusiasts in Singapore have been content with IDs prescribed with incomplete information (eg. ventral only). I still have a few questions and I'll take these up with you over PM.

I appreciate that we are making the effort to scrutinise the details and I'm once again grateful to learn from the knowledge shared here.
I'll leave the ID's as they are in post 75 for now.